Possible New Rules for Fishing

[John Lorenzo]

I personally think the most important thing we as sportsmen can do is to get each and every outdoorsman and outdoorswoman to register to vote. We have great numbers yet there is a huge percentage of us that do not vote. I don't know why. Maybe it's the "my vote won't do anything" attitude. Think of what could be done if even 90 percent of sportsmen voted!!!! I know one thing Rendell wouldn't be gov. of PA!!!!
We have atleast a million sportsmen in PA and I'd bet not even a third of them vote. This to me is our biggest challenge. Just think if everyone of us that does vote got two more sportsmen to vote and so on and so on. By God then politicians would listen~!!!!

[zenrider]

Well I think the idea of bannning fishing is stupid. But also, never underestimate the power of stupid people in large numbers.

The alternative article is very interesting point of view also. And while I am certain that particular writer understands the challenges and issues of commercial fishing vs recreational fishing, I am not at all certain our President and his gang would not make one sweeping move to appease radical green groups. The sportsmen are not as well organzied or funded. Let's face it, we go ape dip if they want to raise our license five dollars. How many of us would give five dollars to an organization to help battle this? Not nearly as many as the combined efforts of several already organized anti fishing anti everything groups. And commercial fishermen are NOT on our side. After years of irresponsible methods, they are the first to point the finger at rec fishing whenever their lively hood is threatened. I think there is going to be more to this fight. I have read about this on other forums and this isn't something that just suddenly cropped up. It has been in the works a while. And while the second artical tends not to be alarmist, well I don't always fall for that either. Putting a PR person in the field to smooth your feathers before they shove it up your bilge hole is also a common technique. The power of the pen will gather followers from both sides. It will be tough sorting truth from propoganda, but careful judgement is more important that reactionary responses.

It looks like it is shaping up to be a challenge that could affect fishing industry jobs, market prices, recreational fishing and laws and methods. I hope you can still appreciate that even in the midst of crisis, I will still find humor, still send some shots across the bow, but ultimately will take action at the pole and with the pen, with the correct information as I understand it.

[lovetoshoot]

I don't like to give kids like the Clair any satisfaction by replying to their "devil's advocate" type of post. To approach such an amazing time in history with a flippant attitude as playing devil's ad. is as bad as those that do hold such bazaar views. The view has real advocates that we need to stand up against with facts and convictions that are based on who we are as sportsmen and women. Emotions will run high on both sides of any animal rights argument and can't be the key element of your side or there will never be a winner. For a supposed lover of the outdoors and second amendment rights to try and rile up people is childish.

Facts about how much good has come from sportsmen being the greatest supporters of conservation and how many jobs and businesses are supported by sportsmen's dollars are arguments that get people with no set opinion on our side. We have to realize that we will never get PETA to agree with us. The battle is for the support of people that have no set opinion about these issues and can be swayed either way.

Some people do not ever want to kill an animal or fish themselves. Because of that, they may take PETA’s side of this in ignorance of what the true consequences would be. Even animal lovers can be won over by facts concerning starvation and disease in areas that aren't hunted. And by showing them how much habitat is being created and protected by the true hunters and fishermen. Not just our license fees and taxes, but the numerous clubs and organizations that love the outdoors.

I hope that we never will have to “fish and hunt anyway”! And that would be a decision for every individual to make if the radical animal rights groups had their way. But I’m positive that saying things like that to people we are trying to win over, will not help our cause.

And as far as all you rebels that did get all riled up, me too! I just wanted to share my opinion after I thought about it and read some more info. Who knows what the future holds! I will pick my battles and strategies carefully!

[doctariAFC]

As some may now be reading, some in the press are claiming this is a hoax - the claim sportfishing could be banned.

Well, to those who say that, I say, peddle your lie to those that have not read the report!

For those interested, here is the report....

http://www.whitehouse.gov/assets/doc...rce_FINAL2.pdf

This became public record on October 5, 2009. We've known about this for a while. Now the public comment period was abruptly closed, despite the contents of this report. Read it carefully. Your best arms in knowledge.

[Snookman]

Our recent ban affected both recreational and commercial. Putting alot of folks out of business. I've heard the grouper fishing here offshore has been fantastic here for years but the government says the opposite. The locals have been fighting this for years and every year the bans get longer. It is definitely here.
http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/outp...shing-ban.html

[Old School Dave]

The speed and power of the internet was once again displayed as an opinion story posted on ESPNOutdoors.com, but not clearly identified as such, started a firestorm of controversy.

On March 9th, the outdoor oriented website posted an article about the work of the Interagency Ocean Policy Task Force, an Obama administration project to look into stewardship of marine resources.

The article's author, Robert Montgomery, wrote in his opening paragraph "The Obama administration has ended public input for a federal strategy that could prohibit U.S. citizens from fishing some of the nation's oceans, coastal areas, Great Lakes, and even inland waters."

This, along with the rest of the article, started internet rumors about a possible ban on recreational fishing that were picked up by various conservative news sites both online and broadcast.

On Thursday, Congresswoman Kathy Dahlkemper (PA 3rd-D), issued a press release reassuring sportsman that the rumor of a fishing ban is false.

"“Recreational fishing is a beloved pastime and tradition in our region—not to mention a valuable local industry. Regrettably, [a] wildly inaccurate [story] is circulating online, fueling a rumor that the federal government plans to ban recreational fishing. That claim is entirely untrue. Neither the administration nor the Congress is seeking to ban recreational fishing, plain and simple,” said Rep. Dahlkemper.

On March 10th, Executive Editor Steve Bowman of ESPNOutdoors.com posted this clarification of Montgomery's article.

In Bowman's posting, he writes, "ESPNOutdoors.com inadvertently contributed to a flare-up Tuesday when we posted the latest article in a series of stories on President Barack Obama's newly created Ocean Policy Task Force, a column written by Robert Montgomery, a conservation writer for BASS since 1985. Regrettably, we made several errors in the editing and presentation of this installment. Though our series has included numerous news stories on the topic, this was not one of them -- it was an opinion piece, and should have been clearly labeled as commentary.

And while our series overall has examined several sides of the topic, this particular column was not properly balanced and failed to represent contrary points of view. We have reached out to people on every side of the issue and reported their points of view -- if they chose to respond -- throughout the series, but failed to do so in this specific column."

[doctariAFC]

The speed and power of the internet was once again displayed as an opinion story posted on ESPNOutdoors.com, but not clearly identified as such, started a firestorm of controversy.

On March 9th, the outdoor oriented website posted an article about the work of the Interagency Ocean Policy Task Force, an Obama administration project to look into stewardship of marine resources.

The article's author, Robert Montgomery, wrote in his opening paragraph "The Obama administration has ended public input for a federal strategy that could prohibit U.S. citizens from fishing some of the nation's oceans, coastal areas, Great Lakes, and even inland waters."

This, along with the rest of the article, started internet rumors about a possible ban on recreational fishing that were picked up by various conservative news sites both online and broadcast.

On Thursday, Congresswoman Kathy Dahlkemper (PA 3rd-D), issued a press release reassuring sportsman that the rumor of a fishing ban is false.

"“Recreational fishing is a beloved pastime and tradition in our region—not to mention a valuable local industry. Regrettably, [a] wildly inaccurate [story] is circulating online, fueling a rumor that the federal government plans to ban recreational fishing. That claim is entirely untrue. Neither the administration nor the Congress is seeking to ban recreational fishing, plain and simple,” said Rep. Dahlkemper.

On March 10th, Executive Editor Steve Bowman of ESPNOutdoors.com posted this clarification of Montgomery's article.

In Bowman's posting, he writes, "ESPNOutdoors.com inadvertently contributed to a flare-up Tuesday when we posted the latest article in a series of stories on President Barack Obama's newly created Ocean Policy Task Force, a column written by Robert Montgomery, a conservation writer for BASS since 1985. Regrettably, we made several errors in the editing and presentation of this installment. Though our series has included numerous news stories on the topic, this was not one of them -- it was an opinion piece, and should have been clearly labeled as commentary.

And while our series overall has examined several sides of the topic, this particular column was not properly balanced and failed to represent contrary points of view. We have reached out to people on every side of the issue and reported their points of view -- if they chose to respond -- throughout the series, but failed to do so in this specific column."

really?

Start connecting the dots...

http://www.examiner.com/x-29556-Vege...otection-score

http://hsus.typepad.com/wayne/2009/1...port-card.html

http://www.hsus.org/web-files/PDF/ch...lf-1-30-09.pdf

http://www.whitehouse.gov/assets/doc...rce_FINAL2.pdf

http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/defa...Task-Force.pdf




someone care to 'splain this stuff?

[treestandtimmy]

I don't like to give kids like the Clair any satisfaction by replying to their "devil's advocate" type of post. To approach such an amazing time in history with a flippant attitude as playing devil's ad. is as bad as those that do hold such bazaar views. The view has real advocates that we need to stand up against with facts and convictions that are based on who we are as sportsmen and women. Emotions will run high on both sides of any animal rights argument and can't be the key element of your side or there will never be a winner. For a supposed lover of the outdoors and second amendment rights to try and rile up people is childish.

Facts about how much good has come from sportsmen being the greatest supporters of conservation and how many jobs and businesses are supported by sportsmen's dollars are arguments that get people with no set opinion on our side. We have to realize that we will never get PETA to agree with us. The battle is for the support of people that have no set opinion about these issues and can be swayed either way.

Some people do not ever want to kill an animal or fish themselves. Because of that, they may take PETA’s side of this in ignorance of what the true consequences would be. Even animal lovers can be won over by facts concerning starvation and disease in areas that aren't hunted. And by showing them how much habitat is being created and protected by the true hunters and fishermen. Not just our license fees and taxes, but the numerous clubs and organizations that love the outdoors.

I hope that we never will have to “fish and hunt anyway”! And that would be a decision for every individual to make if the radical animal rights groups had their way. But I’m positive that saying things like that to people we are trying to win over, will not help our cause.

And as far as all you rebels that did get all riled up, me too! I just wanted to share my opinion after I thought about it and read some more info. Who knows what the future holds! I will pick my battles and strategies carefully!

Bravo........

[youngster]

as usual they have us fighting over one administration versus another.. as we fight and divide THEY consume more and more of our rights.. as long as ive lived my medical insurance hunting and fishing licenses boating , driving you name it has gone up... and every administration has written laws to shackle our freedoms.1 way or another. yet we still feel 1 or the other will free us. bwahahaha like someone said further back in this thread the country boy will survive.. one way or another.

[doctariAFC]

as usual they have us fighting over one administration versus another.. as we fight and divide THEY consume more and more of our rights.. as long as ive lived my medical insurance hunting and fishing licenses boating , driving you name it has gone up... and every administration has written laws to shackle our freedoms.1 way or another. yet we still feel 1 or the other will free us. bwahahaha like someone said further back in this thread the country boy will survive.. one way or another.

the only ones that can "free us" is ourselves.

Please, people, examine what I posted - them 5 links above. Very important that you all do and recognize what is being done, and exactly who is pulling the strings on this! We cannot win if we do not know who we are fighting.

[THEOZON]

I just want to quit my job, take pictures, write a book,do some paintings,and get free healthcare.

[doctariAFC]

I just want to quit my job, take pictures, write a book,do some paintings,and get free healthcare.

hahahahaha.... I tell ya, oh, and let's comb through that HSUS agenda, and clearly see that in point 26 they have stated they are coming after hunting.

Know who the enemy is and you know what the fight will be. And how to win.

I've sent these links to "the world", and all on the distribution list are coming back with dots connected and its sickening comments. And I know from them it went out to many, many more.

When we are informed we can beat these HSUS pukes. They tried the end around in the middle of the night on us in NY with the Pheasant Farm fiasco, send a letter applauding the decision to shutter the Reynolds Farm 5 days before we were informed of the decision.... and we still won.

Gird the loins. My targeting system is swinging to DC...... After I finish with the State Parks mess.

Also, if you have sent the letters, please send one more... To the Lt. Gov. Richard Ravitch. I'll dig out the address and post before I head to teh Outdoors Expo to work the EC Fisheries Advisory Board booth..... 6-8p, stop by and say hi...

[doctariAFC]

Ok folks. I got a LOT more on this one over the past couple days. I recently (Friday, March 19, 2010) I received an invitation to attend a workshop being coordinated by NY Sea Grant on behalf of GLOS (Great Lakes Observing System). Original text of email below.

Subject: Fwd: RE: Arrangements for GLOS Mapping workshop - Buffalo

Dear Great Lakes Colleagues,

New York Sea Grant is helping to coordinate a workshop in the UB Geography Department that is organized by the Great Lakes Observing System (GLOS). I am sending you this message because you may have an interest in learning more about GLOS or Great Lakes mapping.

GLOS is building the capacity to integrate point observations, satellite imagery, and other mapping data to support data driven decision-making about Great Lakes issues.

The workshop is free of charge on April 8, 2010, right at the UB North Campus (see attached PDF). Space is limited to 18 and we are down to 16 openings. We are limited to the size of the computer lab.

If you are interested in learning more about the details please contact Helen Domske, Coastal Education Specialist of New York Sea
Grant: Phone (716) 645-3610 or Email hmd4@cornell.edu.

Please forward this email to any colleague that you think could be interested in this workshop.

I look forward to hearing from you.

Helen

Helen Domske
NY Sea Grant
Great Lakes Program

I unfortunately cannot attend this workshop. However, I did ask a question., my email is as follows:

Subject: RE: RE: Arrangements for GLOS Mapping workshop - Buffalo

Interesting. Unfortunately this runs right smack dab in the middle of a major cutover with the NFTA security systems, so I will not be able to attend. I do have a question however,

What impacts would this system have in terms of implementing "spatial planning" on the Great Lakes?

Her reply as follows:

Hi Rich,

Sorry to hear that your schedule prevents you from taking part, but I knew that would be a concern for folks like you who work during the day. We need to work with the schedule of the presenters from GLOS, and a work-day session worked best for them.

I have copied your message to David Hart, who is running the workshop to see if he can provide more clarification about the spacial planning. I would believe that spacial planning would refer to the placement of structures like marinas or boat launches. Typically, spatial planning is used for land-use planning or environmental planning, but I'll let David answer from the GLOS perspective.

Thanks for your continued interest in the Great Lakes.

Helen

So, she forwarded this onto the GLOS team. And I received the response below:

Rich,

I assume you mean marine spatial planning. This is a White House document outlining an Interim Framework about Coastal and Marine Spatial Planning (see page 9 for mention of the Great Lakes) http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/defa...Task-Force.pdf

The workshop will show how to integrate maps and data about the Great Lakes from distributed sources to support data-driven decision-making. Our examples will likely tie to boating and navigation, but the principles would apply to marine spatial planning as well.

David

Nothing to it, eh? Gird you loins, I can see how this will unfold. The target will be "boating and navigation". Of course, anglers also use boats to navigate to fishing areas, and navigate while fishing, too......

Gird your loins... war's a brewin'

[doctariAFC]

And the plot thickens.... I sent another Q to Mr. Dave Hart, as follows:

Subject: RE: RE: Arrangements for GLOS Mapping workshop - Buffalo

Yes, exactly. And, yes, my question was generated as a result of me consuming this document, and the one that was issued in October as well.

So is this a step towards implementing spatial planning and management in the Great Lakes, per the outlined report?

Thanks

Rich

To which I received just now the following reply:

Subject: RE: RE: Arrangements for GLOS Mapping workshop - Buffalo

Rich,

No, the workshop is not part of a process to implement marine spatial planning in the Great Lakes. It is part of the education and outreach activities associated with the Great Lakes Observing System (http://glos.us/). The purpose of the workshop is to show people how to discover and integrate maps and data on the internet to promote data-driven decision-making about sustainable management of the Great Lakes, especially as it relates to the four main goals of GLOS:
* Improving predictions of climate change and weather and their effects on coastal communities;
* Improving the safety and efficiency of maritime operations;
* Reducing public health risks; and
* Protecting and restoring coastal ecosystems more effectively.

That said, the idea of discovering and integrating distributed sources of maps and data in order to develop your own web mapping application could help people better understand the ideas behind marine spatial planning.
Again, the workshop intends to enable more people to understand the technology behind developing their own web mapping applications.

-David

I am smelling a big old rat..... But that is just me. The first statement is NO to my Q, then, well, read the rest. Sounds fishy to me. But, then again, I have a very large cynical streak when it comes to hearing anything concerning this Whitehouse and what they say, vs what they actually do.

[Grizzly Gary]

I'm with you Doc. I smell a rat in the rafters. Flags are going up in my mind. Not good.

[doctariAFC]

I'm with you Doc. I smell a rat in the rafters. Flags are going up in my mind. Not good.

We know who is orchestrating this (HSUS) and we know their position concerning outdoors recreation and the consumptive activities. We know the WH is a "friend" to HSUS, and we can see the Interim report is strikingly similar in language to some of the points in the HSUS 100-point agenda.

And now we have these wonderful workshops to start the indoctrination, oops, I mean education process. And, since the "focus" would be supposedly for marine boating and navitagion concerns, which anglers use boats and navigate to waters where fish are in the Great Lakes, I can see how this will unfold.

Enact so many regulations on a level that is so microscopic that the end result will be high confusion, and a complete abandonment of the sports on the Great lakes due to not wanting to risk being in violation from one mile to the next.

Gird your loins. And, also start boning up on what "marine spatial planning and management" truly means. Really dig, folks, arm yourself with the knowledge, as that is the only armor that works. We have some time to get better informed on the notions being pushed. Stay vigilent, as, if we read the HSUS agenda, they have much in mind for our lands and implementing similar things, which would again result in utter confusion and frustration, incongruity of rules, etc.

Their battle plan is taking shape in my mind, and I KNOW I CAN BEAT THEM EVERY WHICH WAY TILL SUNDAY. But we ALL neeed to be well informed, and speak in numbers when that time comes, and that time is approaching rapidly.

[doctariAFC]

oh yeah, one more thing, I am working on solidifying another very powerful ally, the BSA. I have been asked to get involved in helping the BSA with finding projects for their "Legacy 11" initiative, which is involving Boy Scouts to volunteer to rehabilitate parks and whatnot for more access and use by everyone. A colleague of mine that I worked with closely in Erie County, who has since retired from his DPW position, put my name out there with the people heading this effort. CE Chris Collins is also highly involved with BSA. Although the focus is on projects in Erie and Niagara Counties, this thing could blossom into something on the Habitat/ Access side of things. Starting small first, as we at the County Fisheries Advisory Board are trying to get the commissioner's lake at Chestnut Ridge Park open to the public for fishing. Bouy Scouts appear to be on board with doing the work needed to be done. This would be huge, and set the BSA firmly into our ally column, come thick or thin.

Rally the troops and recruit more armies to join our side. I guess I received the Public Relations of the Year Award from Erie County Sportsmen and Women for 2010 for a darned good reason. And more is coming..... Much, much more.

Can you all tell that the liberal anti pukes have fired me up? And, as you all know, you don't want to fire me up.... Battle on.... Game on.....

[fishtamer]

I thought PETA stood for "People Eating Tasty Animals". No wonder I'm confused.

[doctariAFC]

I thought PETA stood for "People Eating Tasty Animals". No wonder I'm confused.

We're not talking about PETA and the PETArds.

We are talking about HSUS and their 100-point agenda of animal rights nonsense sent to Obama for implementation.

And that is what he is doing.

[doctariAFC]

Had some in depth discussions on this one last night during our Fisheries Advisory Board meeting. Today, one of my colleagues is participating in the GLOS mapping workshop, and will be recording the entire session.

Will know more about this push and how many prongs to the deception exist. Will report back in a few days with additional info.